Lost Discussion Group: What's Next?

Good to see this. I've been having some lively discussions over on my Infinite Regress blog about new questions that have arisen with the sensational finale. I'll be happy to come over here and further discuss.

Thinking about the end of Season 2 and the start of Season 3, we only really picked up the whole Penny/(Ant?)Arctic Station/Rescue thread toward the latter part of S3.

Would the writers/producers do something similar with the start of Season 4? Leave viewers hanging until the second part of the season??

Just a thought.

"Diligent, underpaid teaching assistant" - nice. I am, however, REALLY happy we're continuing this discussion over the next 8 months, class.

Okay, as for where we start season 4, here are some thoughts/pros and cons:

1) Locke. We follow him away from where Jack is making the phone call, to wherever it is he's going. PRO: offers a chance to quickly offer a "What the F&^%?" moment if he goes someplace interesting (i.e. Jacob's lair, a gun stash, etc.) Plus it doesn't go directly towards the huge flash forward storyline (and we know how the powers that be like to delay gratification on these things). CON: except for the pilot, we've never started with one of our island main characters - we always start with someone unknown who become major (Season 2 in the hatch with Desmond, Season 3 at the house with Juliet).

2) Desmond in the Looking Glass - meaning that what we saw at the end of the season finale was, indeed a Desmond flash, and he realizes he needs to prevent unknown disaster by letting in Jack and the non-Hurley Losties on his precognitive abilities to save them from the ruin of "rescue." PRO: Immediate payoff/answer for the finale. CON: Why payoff the season finale mystery immediately? Plus, see Locke's comment above.

3) The Temple. We're introduced to more Others and Richard at the "Temple"....and perhaps even Jacob, finally. PRO: Not really sure...still, seeing the Temple would introduce a new set piece, locale to the island, which would be interesting. CON: not sure how this shocks that much...

4) Naomi's ship - this seems like a good bet. We meet see the man on the other end of the phone, doing something normal before the call. The phone rings, he answers it, and WHAM, we realize we're on Naomi's ship...he gets off the phone, and tells his paramilitary group to grab their guns for an extermination. Oooooh. PROS: fits with introducing a new character (who may be a main character) in first minutes, fits with theme of retelling a past event from a different perspective in the first moments of the season (again, Season 2 the explosion of the hatch, season 3 the crashing of the plane), and sends a chill when the audience realizes Ben is right and that the "rescue" is actually going to wipe them out. CON: honestly? I can't see any.

Another option is Penelope somehow...we see her in an office, or something, then we have the Charlie call, and then follow what she does next, which would be somewhat similar to #4 above.

5) "He" who is with Kate. We see his body but not his face, doing household stuff, looking at the clock. Kate walks in, kisses him on the cheek, sets down her purse. He asks her where she's been. She says running an errand, goes to bathroom. He checks her purse, finds her cellphone, goes to last call received, and sees Jack, and realizes she was lying. As the camera pans back, we see his face, just as Kate says "Jacob, are you coming to bed?" PRO: in the future, which is awesome. And we see Jacob, which is awesome. Plus we're in the future, making the island flashbacks, which fits the "game change." CON: not quite as cool as some other ideas, plus we're starting in the future, which means we're getting to the ending mystery of season 3 immediately, rather than drawing it out a bit, like the producers like to.

For some odd reason, I haven't watched Lost since episode two of season two, but have picked up this blog and Bastard Machine's, and have become totally enamoured of the writing of the blogs and the comments, especially! Watched one or two of the actual shows and enjoy reading about the show more that watching it. Will eventually catch up from the beginning with the DVDs, but will continue to read all of the wonderful, imaginative writing from you guys. You are terrific. Get the summer started!

I vote for the ship. I believe the flashback starts with our new character (leader of the ship goers) preparing Naomi and her crew for liftoff and offering some last minute instruction on how to use the Desmond photo as a cover story. Throughout the flashback we come to realize that those on the ship DO NOT know that the survivors of Oceanic 815 are on the island as they are just trying to find the island for some devilish reason that remains secret --perhaps for the whole season. When Naomi's copter crashes we see that the new character feels that he must deal with the failure of not finding the island (it will be implied that he has tried before and failed) but the final flashback of the episode features him receiving the call and pinpointing the location of the island after which he relays a sinister command to prep the strike force. The story that is happening on the island features Desmond racing to find the survivors to tell them that it's not Penny's boat. He returns to Hurley, Sayid, Sawyer, Jin, Bernard, and Juliet on the beach, tells them what's happening, they radio Jack but it's too late. The boat people are already on their way.

Here's an additional question to ponder related to the one James posted:

- What "song" will play during the first scene? (Note Season 2's Mama Cass, and Season 3's Downtown)

Oh, that one's easy. Nancy Sinatra's Sugar Town.

http://www.last.fm/music/Nancy+Sinatra/_/Sugar+Town

I think the show starts off with Jacob and how he was created. I kind of feel that Jacob is a manifestation of Ben's will or desire for a father figure. I think the island itself sort of eats or uses emotions to create other things. The black cloud always seems to appear when emotions are high (from what I recall).

I would be surprised if they turned away from the Jack starts the season format in season four so I would imagine the flashbacks (forwards) are of him.

Just another crazy theory of course =).

I really hope that if they pull a time jump, that they do it well. Battlestar Galactica was done well, but season 3 of alias, not so much. I think they will continue with the present narrative and shift the flashforwards into future episodes. Carlton said the whole story will tell the past, present, and future of the characters and how the island changes them. But this flashforward thing will definitely give many more interesting developments. Hopefully, this eight month break will give us an even tighter narrative with no filler episodes that we saw earier this season.

I really hope that if they pull a time jump; they do it well. Battlestar Galactica was done well, but season 3 of alias, not so much. I think they will continue with the present narrative and shift the flashforwards into future episodes. Carlton said the whole story will tell the past, present, and future of the characters and how the island changes them. But this flashforward thing will definitely give many more interesting developments. Hopefully, this eight month break will give us an even tighter narrative with no filler episodes that we saw earier this season.

Let me rephrase, I think that it will show Jacob's existence as the opener, and we'll find later on that he's created by Ben (whether Ben realizes it or not)

Another couple questions:

1. Is the first episode a flash forward or flash back?

2. Who's is it?

I understand why Lock himself would not want to ever leave the island, but the mystery is how Locke had the foresight that it is not in the interest of any of the Losties to leave the island (and why he destroyed the sub, to Jack: “you’re not supposed to do this”). Does Lock have a general "bad feeling" about leaving that he "senses" from the island, or is there something more concrete going on? Maybe he has future flashes like Desmond? I think an episode dedicated to Locke’s knowledge would definitely be interesting, but maybe it would reveal too many secretes.

@Megan: I have the sense Locke has more of an intuition about the nature of the island than actual premonitions. He seems to have intuited something about the "purpose" of the island, its relationship to the people on it, and how people are supposed to prroperly commune with it. (His lecture to Ben, about how the Others are, I think he said "Pharisees," for eating chicken and living in houses, was meant to be significant, I think.)

My hunch, and it is only that, is that Locke doesn't feel it's time for Jack and the rest to leave yet. That there is something they are meant to accomplish on the island, some personal journeys they have not yet completed. There's something about that specific phrasing, which I agree is very significant: "You're not supposed to do this." That doesn't sound like what you would say to a person you necessarily believed was NEVER supposed to leave the island. It sounds more like what you would say to someone who is not supposed to leave YET, or not in this way. "It's not supposed to happen like this," seemed to be his meaning, more than, "What you're doing is forbidden." Does that make any sense?

Again, nothing more than a hunch, though.

Who wants to bet that Jacob is somehow from the distant past and is tied to the Black Rock?

When Walt appeared to Locke and told him he had work to do, was it making his way back to Jacob and freeing him from the circle of sand? Has he communed with Jacob?

James, what is interesting about the "Pharisees" living in houses and eating chicken is that Jacob dislikes modern technology. Any connection? Is that something else Locke intuited?

James, I definitely agree. And that reading makes a lot of sense, when looked at in light of Jack's desperate desire to return to the island - there is something there unfinished, something he needed to do before he left that he's desperately trying to return to finish. Perhaps Kate "finished" it and is happy/content with her life/Volvo/husband.

This option also leaves open the option (however far-fetched) that "dead" characters who resolved their past issues could have "died" on the island but were reborn in the "outside" world....in other words, the island was some type of metaphysical proving ground where these flawed people could meet their problems head on and solve them before achieving "rescue" from the island.....Jack is so pained because by calling the boat and saving the others, he never fixed his fatal flaw - his pathological need to fix things and save people.

I definitely see an immediate pick-up on the island. The flash-forward seems like another lone clue that'll be ignored initially and further explored later (like the monster, or the fluorescent hatch drawing).

If Lost spends too much time in the future, it'll kill the gravitas of the "stranded" drama on the present-day Island.

Well, I know one thing: It would appear they get rescued much faster than the Skipper and Gilligan. Notwithstanding, I spent three years on Oahu and I must ask: Who in their right mind would want to be rescued from Oahu?

OK, kidding aside, I think their is a connection between the Black Smoke and Jacob and Black Rock.

Side note: Speaking of the black smoke, I discovered a blooper. When the black smoke confronted Julia at the perimeter fence, why did it not simply go over the barrier? You know, like Kate did?

For me to guess what happens next is to guess what is going through the minds of the writers. I do not have that kind of time. However, I will let you in on something when it comes to trying to figure out the enigma of this show: The writers will maintain the mystique at all costs. One of them said that it is the mystique that brings viewers back each week. Ultimately, this is about ratings, so, you can bet your bottom dollar that they will write whatever it takes to maintain the mystique; even if it means not tying up loose ends.

Oh, one more thing: Why has not the body of Jacks father been found? If you recall, in the very beginning, his fathers' casket was empty when Jack found it in the cave. He! He! Figure that one out...

HUGE plot hole: why had no one ever simply tried to cut the cable going down to the Looking Glass? Wouldn't it make sense to at least try, on the hope that it either powers the station (and cutting power would turn off the transmitter) or that the cable is a communications line up and out, in which case cutting it would also stop the transmissions? Wouldn't that make sense to try that, before diving down to the underwater station?

SL: I think the cable to the Looking Glass was a tether, not a power supply.

TA Chaddogg: The shop owner who clued in Desmond on his abilities said that fate cannot ultimately be averted. There has been chatter on other blogs about the flashforward being Desmond's take on the future and that it doesn't represent what will actually happen. But no matter what Desmond or anyone else does to prevent individual scenarios the outcome is still the same. Des warded or Charlie's death as long as possible, but Charlie died anyway. Jack is toast, I'm afraid.

I'd like to see everyone help Jin communicate by learning a little Korean.

I've read the cable is meant to be a tether too. Although: a tether? To what? Doesn't look like that thing was going to float away anytime soon. This explanation seems on the order of "A wizard did it" to me, but honestly, I'm willing to suspend disbelief on this one.

losteastereggs.blogspot.com has a closeup of the Looking Glass. It clearly says "Anchor to island" on it.

http://bp2.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/RkyrBlYigWI/AAAAAAAAFdQ/L2rJDCy_g5s/s1600-h/ep320_05_240x360.jpg

@Gerry & @Poniewozik:

A tether? Please. The station was shown firmly mounted to the sea floor like an oil rig. IMHO, and no offense, but it doesn't take an engineering degree (or a kindergarten graduation, for that matter) for the viewer to realize that 1) holding a station that big with a cable that small would be like suspending a car with a human hair and 2) people pick the cable up all the time, flexing it more than a meter, indicating there is no tension on it. It is definitely a power cable of some kind. Granted, it may be a defunct cable left over from the construction of the station, but I'm not one of the writers.

I suppose I stand corrected after viewing the schematic of the Looking Glass hatch, it does say "Anchor to Land." But that cable has no tension on it and "anchor" does not necessarily mean a structural anchor, it can be a synonym for communications / power backbone.

Other Minor hole: Radio wave transmissions, like the one running for 16 years, would not interfere with a satellite transceiver which depends on a simple line-of-sight up/down link.

Why not, SL? Isn't the satellite uplink radio frequency?